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de
| | Posted on Monday, July 07, 2003 - 1:03 am: | 
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Why does everyone talk about power and loud as if they were immortal icons.
First loud...
Loud only means distorted if you press beyond the 100% at the "PEAKS" of your voice. Note I said peaks not average. And distortion only makes it more difficult to discern between certain words. I makes you sound like a mush mouth.
What you want is Compression NOT loud. There is a difference.
Power, the second worthless icon...
I once worked a ham station in Maine running 1/10th of a watt and he leveld my meter at an S 9 with perfectly clear audio.
How could he do this. Propagation of course. I hate to break it to you but the solar cycle is on the downside and getting worse. All the power in the world is not going to help you if the propagation conditions/the ability of the atmosphere to bounce your signals is screwed up. AND just because someone hears you running extra juce does not mean that they can in turn reach you if they are running only legal 4/12.
Conclusion....
What is the secret? Actually no secret at all. Propogation is the big secret that most CB people forget. Wait for atmosphereic and solar conditions to be optimum and be there at that time. If you want to schedule when to be on the air check out the ham and shortwave pubications. Many publish computer calculated predictions of the most optimum times for a host of radio frequencies. If your CB band is not listed use the 10 meter ham band--close enough.
In closing remember that a person talking to himself is no conversation. It take 2 or more to hold a conversation.
DE |
Kd4amg
| | Posted on Monday, July 07, 2003 - 8:26 am: |
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also dont forget the antenna...you can have the best/loudest transmitter in the town you are in, and without an efficient ANTENNA, you dont do a lot of communicating. Antenna is more important than transmitter ( but if folks disagree, all is okay )...I aint here to argue, just swap ideas !! |
Tech808
| | Posted on Monday, July 07, 2003 - 8:40 am: |
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With a Properly Tuned Radio,a Good Microphone, and Scope, & other test equipment, you can set your equipment up to Be LOUD and not distorted and still run your modulation at around 90%.
With condition's they way they are now you need a good clean radio that will perform at 100%, run Clean and be LOUD.
If you do not have a Scope to see & set your radio with you will have no idea where you have it.
A modulation meter will only let you know if you are over or under 100% modulation.
But, that 100% can be so distorted that a stock 4/12 watt radio can be heard and understood at twice the distance.
LOUD does not always mean distorted.
POWER when used Correctly with a Properly Tuned Radio for Maximum Performance is NOT worthless.
Your antenna system ie: Antenna, Coax, Connection's, also plays a MAJOR part in any communication's.
If it is not performing at 100% the best radio in the world will not be able to perform at 100%.
Just my thought's.
Lon
Tech808 
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de
| | Posted on Monday, July 07, 2003 - 7:09 pm: |
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RE 808
I agree with your statements, hence my statement not over 100% on the peaks.
The problem is that the uneducated operator always cranks the D104 up so darn much they excede 100% for the majority of each word sounding in an effort eek out that so called valuable last watt. Which no one will be able to distinguished anyway.
If they would use a good compressor and sound compression techniques they would max out their signal without becomming mud mouth.
As a tech you know this to be a fact and have stated so much. As an Extra Class Amateur and an amateur op for many many years I know that as well. Just how do we get these youngsters to realize this as well?
A cold virtual
brew on the back
stoop just for you
DE |
De
| | Posted on Monday, July 07, 2003 - 7:24 pm: |
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RE 808 and power...
I am posting this as a separate post so as not to merge this with the previous post.
I post from many years of personal experience.
In re to power. I have seen this, I can hear you but I cannot reach you, so many times. And it has happened to me so many times that I just quit counting. With my station runnig a weak barefoot (power out the back) power and only wire antennas having no gain I know this one way power or vastly superior antenna trip all too well.
I make the above statement not out of jealosy because I understand their use of leverage. I used to operate an amp but quit doing so because using it limited the number of people whome I could actually talk to at arm chair level of comfort.
So while power may be usefull if both parties have power and or the antennas it is a two edged sword. Those having can talk, those not having cannot even make the return trip. |
Allagator
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 08, 2003 - 4:17 pm: |
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WOW !!!! It sounds like your talking about me !! he he !!!! just reading the post !!!! and i had to put my 1% in on it !!!! |
RCI 2990
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 09, 2003 - 1:06 am: |
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Its just the way CBers think guys. Sorry but no one will change them and no one ever will. The only ones to blame are NOT the CBers that do this stuff but the FCC for dropping the lisensing reqirements and the lack of enforcements...... |
Crafter
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 09, 2003 - 2:03 am: |
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De, speaking from my own experience the most power needed for communication is 200 watts. Unless your doing competition then the sky's the limit!
One point I don't answer everytime someone calls not stuck up just lazy, like most I've done DX and the challenge is gone for me so now its a past time. |
Kirk
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 09, 2003 - 4:46 pm: |
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RCI, although I agree that the FCC made a mistake for dropping licensing and lack of enforcement, people still need to be accountable for themselves. The rules haven't changed regarding output power, tower heights, etc. Everyone knows that, they just either "pretend" they don't know or they have no regard to hold the laws set for one reason or another. Just my 2 cents.- |
de
| | Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2003 - 12:54 am: |
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Re Crafter....
I quite agree with your statements. Under normal conversational, no contest environments that is more than enough juce to reach anyone who can hear you.
Yaesu, if I remember correctly, has a model or had a model that had a 200 watt power output out the back of the radio. One of their upper crust rigs if I remember correctly.
May your day be productive and your family be in good health.
DE |
de
| | Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2003 - 1:30 am: |
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Topic, Guys let us at least be fair with the FCC...
Hmm, let us at least be fair with the FCC and state the environment in which they had to operate. And too the rules and regs back then and even now are screwed up for the CB Class.
Remember way back when, it the late 60s and early 70s. There were so many CB radios out in the market and in use there was absolutely no way for the FCC to effectively police the CBers. Oh they tried for a while but it was hopeless from the start.
Also the rules and regs were Mickey Mouse to say the least. For example in the ham rules and regs you must ID at certain intervals and times. I do not ever remember having heard anyone on CB ever ID with his station call (even when the FCC did issue the CB licenses).
Which brings me to licenses themselves. It might just be me, but I do not consider the filling out of an application, mailing it to the FCC and gettin a license to be "Licensing". At least to me, licensing is when you have to study, memorize, learn and take a test to get the license aka the Amateur and Commercial Licenses. If you invest hours and hours of study to obtain the license you will be less likely to become a major rule violator. That which we attain too easily we value too lightly.
My proposal to the FCC for CB would be as follows...
Item 1: Require that all CB operators obtain a FCC issued license similar to that issued to Amateur Radio ops and Commercial Radio ops.
Item 2: Related to item 1, said License requiring a written examination of sufficient difficulty and complexity that an actual study commitment be required. Testing could be done under an official FCC certified VE type of system.
Item 3: Having achieved said license, operators should be allowed to use VFO type radios within the existing CB radio spectrum.
Item 4: Some increas of power should be permtted if a person devotes any serious amout of time devoted to study for a written test to obtain a license. I would have no problem if the current power limits were increased to 75 watts PEP.
Item 5: Rules of CB should be ammended in view of testing and licensing to include manditory license/call sign ID similar to that used in the Amateur Bands.
Item 6: A relaxation of Antenna height restrictions. I would have no problem letting them have a 100 ft height limitation. Although probably only a few would put up a 100 ft tower.
Item 7: The deletion of the provisions that prohibit DX communications in the CB spectrum. Let them talk overseas if they wish.
Item 8: Modes of operation should be increased to allow the use of Packet, and other digital communications on the CB frequencies.
Item last, at least for now: Under current CB regs business communications are permitted in the CB spectrum. I would have these passages striken and the use restricted only to personal communications of a non commercial nature.
DE |
RCI 2990
| | Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2003 - 2:16 am: |
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I dont want to sound rude but go to any CB radio shop and talk to the guys about stuff alot of rougue CBers dont like to talk about like FCC rules, hams, no limiter removal, power, 100% modulation, and you either will get LOL'ed at, cussed at, or looked at like you are stupid.. Believe me ive tried it..... Waste of time to try to get most of them to behave, obey the rules, and "play nice"... |
Sixkiller505
| | Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2003 - 9:32 am: |
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HEY DE!! Ilike your idea!! if you ran for office you'd get my vote!!your idea would make cb very interesting,being a diehard cber that's a compromise i think all cber's who meant well,could live with.cbers are somewhat like children,a child get's bored he will cut up weather it's right or wrong.but with your idea,it will keep them busy and happy(for a few years anyway) maybe you should submit your idea to the fcc and see what comes back.but back to the old lic# thing. no they really mean't nothing ,but in my part of the country everybody did'nt use handles, so station numbers were alive in virgina.that's all you had to define who you were and we used our station ID NUMBERS with pride before and after transmission(we thought they meant something,and to us they did.untell hams would drop down to our channels and contantly remind us how stipid we were,and we were on channels that nobody wanted and that's how we ended up with them(in those day's some rogue hams really gave your morale a kick in the pants) but i'am only speaking about virginia.still have my numbers KBDM7102 and when i talk to our old club members from back in the day(i'am 53 years old) out of rememberance for the old days that how we still close out our qso.some kid will always ask after we are through"what did they say"?? or did you have to buy that? how can i get one"? we just quietly smile to our selves. KBDM7102 CLEAR!! |
Diggerodell
| | Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2003 - 11:54 am: |
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some hams dont play by the rule so why should cb operators??? just does not sound fair to me!!!!!!!! |
Rippedradio
| | Posted on Thursday, July 10, 2003 - 10:38 pm: |
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Well i for one do not like the license idea i think it's great u do not need a license for cb! if you put stiff test restrictions and license restrictions it would just turn into another 10meter band, whats the fun in that??? i have met alot of great people on the cb radio and i have also met alot of idiots, it's best just to ignor the idiots and enjoy! the liscense is one reason i have not gotten my amature liscence yet, i have a hard time studing and remembering things my mother allways said i have A.D.D. maybe thats the problem???oh well enough rag chewin for me? 73's p.s. maybe if we all set a good example and have good skip qso's people would get jelous and try and follow?? just a thought! |
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