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Message |
    
Goat373
Junior Member
Username: Goat373
Post Number: 20
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2005 - 7:50 pm: | 
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I have a slight problem with my president jackson...it has a 10 watt DK on USB. LSB however is working perfectly...I am a decent tech...as in i could fix it if i knew where to look for the faulty area. any help would be great
~Goat |
Iluvrf
Intermediate Member
Username: Iluvrf
Post Number: 127
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, June 15, 2005 - 9:39 pm: |
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An alignment would be the first place to start |
Hollowpoint445
Intermediate Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 403
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, June 16, 2005 - 7:15 am: |
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I agree - a full alignment is in order. And when doing the transmitter alignment pay particular attention to carrier balance. |
Goat373
Junior Member
Username: Goat373
Post Number: 22
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, June 18, 2005 - 10:59 pm: |
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fixed it...carrier balance out of whack |
Bigbob
Senior Member
Username: Bigbob
Post Number: 1988
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, June 19, 2005 - 6:44 am: |
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I'm with Goat never apply a 10 gauge shotgun when a .22 will suffice.C'mon you guys,Goat read carrier balance,he went there and made the repair,simple and sweet.My eagle 2000 had a 2 watt dead key on usb,I put up with it till the warranty was off then opened her up went to carrier balance and fixed it.I never use usb,but I want my stuff perfect,and can't stand to be without a radio even for a day,so I waited and did it myself.You go Goat.Bigbob |
Goat373
Junior Member
Username: Goat373
Post Number: 23
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, June 19, 2005 - 3:27 pm: |
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now i just need to figure out how to get the am DK under 10watts...thats as low as i can get it...oh well...i may just live with it and build/buy/modify and amp to handle the higher dk |
Hollowpoint445
Intermediate Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 416
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, June 19, 2005 - 5:59 pm: |
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I asked myself why is the carrier balance is adjusted incorrectly? The answer I came up with is that someone got inside the radio and started turing pots randomly. Because of that I recommended a full alignment because that's what I would have done if it was a friend's radio. Who knows what else isn't adjusted properly? |
Vanillagorilla
Member
Username: Vanillagorilla
Post Number: 72
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, July 02, 2005 - 8:50 am: |
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This is going to sound silly but My Superstar had a "sometimes" 10w DK and sometimes not on either sideband.
Ended up being the D104 picking up the sound of a fan across the room! Heehee...
Thought I was on to something because it only did it when it was hot out..well that the only time I had the fan on!
Had no idea how sensitive that mic was till then.
Sorry...I had to bring that up..
Hank '905 |
Hollowpoint445
Intermediate Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 470
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, July 02, 2005 - 11:12 am: |
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Wow! How loud was that fan? |
Yankee
Advanced Member
Username: Yankee
Post Number: 708
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 02, 2005 - 12:36 pm: |
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You will find that the D-104 is the best money will afford and the most sensitive of any microphone, it will pick any sound in the house. I have watched my watt meter on transmit as a house fly way buzzing around and the D-104 picked up the fly buzzing close to the microphone.
Carl CEF-357 |
Crackerjack
Advanced Member
Username: Crackerjack
Post Number: 686
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, July 02, 2005 - 2:54 pm: |
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Yankee... I wish the D-104 worked well on the Magnum 257. |
Hollowpoint445
Intermediate Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 480
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 03, 2005 - 2:39 pm: |
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Why doesn't it? You'll have to be careful to adjust the ouput level because the 257 has a compression amplifier which adds tons of mic gain already. If you're careful it should work fine. |
Vanillagorilla
Member
Username: Vanillagorilla
Post Number: 74
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, July 03, 2005 - 4:32 pm: |
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YANKEE! HA! Me too! Had a pesty one buzzing me last week! He uppped my AM DK whenever he got within a foot of the mic!
My buddy heard it on his end..thought it was a weed whacker outside my house! Heehee!
Hank '905 |
Hollowpoint445
Intermediate Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 483
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Monday, July 04, 2005 - 6:45 am: |
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Wow - How far away from the mic is your mouth? I can't imagine how a fly a foot away from the microphone could wind up in your audio. |
Coyote
Intermediate Member
Username: Coyote
Post Number: 266
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, July 04, 2005 - 11:33 am: |
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Some of those bigger fly's sound like small aircraft.....  |
Yankee
Advanced Member
Username: Yankee
Post Number: 716
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 04, 2005 - 4:47 pm: |
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The base D-104s are one microphone you can't close talk with the audio they have, arms distance is advised. How well I know, I've been running a D-104 of some sort for 40 plus years, the only one you can close talk is the non-ampilified model. I'll stop useing a D-104 when they take it from my cold dead hands. It's just the best there ever was or ever will be. On a base installation I don't care to hold a microphone in my hand or close talk a desk microphone. When you hear me on the CEF nets you are hearing a Silver Eagle at arms distance, in a normal telephone speaking voice.
Carl CEF-357 |
Hollowpoint445
Intermediate Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 490
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Monday, July 04, 2005 - 6:13 pm: |
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Arm distance is the problem. Turn down the amplification so it's barely hitting 100% modulation on the radio when you're close talking the microphone and you'll sound far better.
EVERY microphone sounds better when it's close talked because sound degrades rapidly with distance. Don't take my word for it, read what Heil, Shure, and every other quality microphone manufacturer recommends.
WAY TOO MANY people crank up the amplifier thinking it makes you louder, when all it does is make the paint drying as loud as your voice - or louder.
I disagree about the D104 being the best ever microphone. It certainly is cool looking, but I think inexpensive electret microphones sound better than a D104 because they have a more even frequency response. |
Yankee
Advanced Member
Username: Yankee
Post Number: 718
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Monday, July 04, 2005 - 7:22 pm: |
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I am running at 100% modulation and monitor it very closely. The D-104 sounds very good to just about everyone I talk to, and after 40 plus years I haven't found a better sounding or better looking microphone to set on my desk and also I've tried a long list of different microphones at a great expense. The on air audio also has a lot to do with the radio, I'm at present running the Uniden Grant XL on the base installation. Altough the 10-DA head has a lot softer voice quality.
Carl CEF-357 |
Hollowpoint445
Intermediate Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 494
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 05, 2005 - 9:29 am: |
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"The on air audio also has a lot to do with the radio"
It really shouldn't. Most communications gear has about the same audio bandwidth, so things should sound about the same. I think the reason this happens so much on CB radios is clipped limiters. When they're improperly operated and overdriven the tone changes because voice peaks are lost as splatter and you're left with a bassier sound. If the radio has an operating limiter it should sound about the same as any other radio with the same microphone. |
Yankee
Advanced Member
Username: Yankee
Post Number: 721
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 05, 2005 - 6:55 pm: |
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Hollowpoint, you answered you're own question with your explanation as to why the radio is the biggest part of the on the air audio. Some 11 meter radios function quite well after the limiter has been removed, if the microphone is properly adjusted and the microphone gain on the radio is also properly set at 100% modulation the station will sound very good.
Carl CEF-357 |
Hollowpoint445
Advanced Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 501
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 05, 2005 - 8:30 pm: |
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"Hollowpoint, you answered you're own question with your explanation as to why the radio is the biggest part of the on the air audio."
Biggest part? No way. It's the microphone. Even when the limiter is clipped the microphone's ouput level still controls the audio. The only time the radio comes into play is when the radio has a clipped limiter and the operator intentionally misuses the microphone.
"Some 11 meter radios function quite well after the limiter has been removed, if the microphone is properly adjusted and the microphone gain on the radio is also properly set at 100% modulation the station will sound very good."
You've got to be kidding! The ONLY reason people cut a modulation limiter is to sound louder. In order to do that they must overmodulate. That's both poor radio etiquette and operating technique. |
Iluvrf
Intermediate Member
Username: Iluvrf
Post Number: 146
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 05, 2005 - 9:56 pm: |
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You can tell 99% of the people that cut limiters. Very rarley will you hear a cut radio sound remotely decent. It serves a purpose people, Leave it alone |
Yankee
Advanced Member
Username: Yankee
Post Number: 722
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 05, 2005 - 10:58 pm: |
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I give up. I operate sideband and I'm very careful about not over driving my audio, I did say I operate at 100% modulation and monitor it closely. I did not say the audio limiter in any of my radios has been "CLIPPED". They haven't been. |
Iluvrf
Intermediate Member
Username: Iluvrf
Post Number: 147
Registered: 2-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 4:17 am: |
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But if you run your d-104 at arms length you do not have it set properly. Turn it down so you can close talk and achive 100%, and you will be suprised at the difference it makes |
Hollowpoint445
Advanced Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 503
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 5:58 am: |
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Good for you Yankee! C'mon now, you've got to admit you were arguing a rather thin point. Nobody clips a limiter and then carefully adjusts his microphone while watching an oscilloscope to make sure they don't overmodulate. |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 6255
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 10:19 am: |
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Any Power Microphone is just NOT designed to be used at arms length.
On a D-104 that Grill on the Mic Element Head is there to keep you from harming the Mic Element with your lips.
On a Turner Desk Mic the mic element is recessed about 1/4" to protect it.
Mic guards/grills are designed to be a functional part of the microphone and not just placed there to make the mic look pretty.
That is why every single microphone hand or desk mic comes with a protective cover over the mic element. And that is why some hand mic's even come with a Lip Guard.
Microphones be it a hand or desk mic are designed to be operated with your lips being from 1/2 to roughly 3 inches from the mic element.
If it is a power mic the farther away from the mic you are the more you have to crank the power up on the mic or the Mic Gain on a radio to compensate for the distance to be heard and the greater the chance of over modulation and adjacent channel splatter and distortion.
Just my 2 cent's,
Lon
Tech808
CEF808
N9OSN
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Stickshift
Intermediate Member
Username: Stickshift
Post Number: 232
Registered: 7-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 06, 2005 - 3:24 pm: |
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Lon, you are correct.
This is why I prefer hand mics over desk mics. People use desk mics for various reasons, be it preference, looks, ect. Some operators simply use them because they like to sit back in a chair and not stuff a microphone in their faces. Then in turn, they have to increase the mic gain and all hell breaks loose. Overmodulation occcurs along with another of my pet peaves, background noise. Some stations have some much background noise that their voice becomes totally unintelligable.
On my 706mkiig I use either the stock hand microphone or heil traveler with vox for hands free use. On my ts-2000 I use the stock hand microphone as well. I get very good audio reports with both radios. On my cobra 2000 it's a different story. I use a turner +3 because the audio is much clearer and cleaner when adjusted properly, and I've never liked the feel of stock cobra hand mics. On the siltronix, which has sat idle for quite some time now, I use an unamplified d104 TUP mic. There are 2 reasons I use this mic with this radio. The major reason is because this rig requires a high Z mic and I just couldn't pass this 1 up at $20. I was looking at some old turner high Z hand mics, but they bring a pretty penny these days. The other reason I use the d104 with the "silly box" is because it compliments the look of the radio.
Like I've said, "different strokes for different folks". But the 1 fact that remains with any microphone is proper mic adjustment and staying within a couple inches of the mic element. For those who don't agree, give this a try sometime and you'll be amazed at the results. You'll have more operators wanting to make qso's with you than ever before.
73
stickshift |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 1014
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, July 09, 2005 - 9:55 am: |
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the instructions for a turner +2SSB desk mic specifically say to hold the mic 12-16 INCHES from your mouth...not quite arms length, but not 1/2 to 3 INCHES away, either. and the turner M+3 handheld say to hold mic 1/4 INCH from your mouth. on the rare times i use 'em, i find an inch or 2 from my mouth works fine.
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Hollowpoint445
Advanced Member
Username: Hollowpoint445
Post Number: 520
Registered: 6-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, July 09, 2005 - 12:52 pm: |
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The instructions say to hold a desk mic? Hmmm. I've used my +2 at about 2" and it didn't detonate so I guess it's fine to use it that way.
The fact remains, the farther from your mouth the more likely you are to have background noise and less voice detail. Professionals close talk microphones for just that reason. If you want background noise in your audio then go right ahead and use your microphones however you like, but I like to sound the best I can with the equipment own. |
Bigbob
Senior Member
Username: Bigbob
Post Number: 2033
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Sunday, July 10, 2005 - 10:36 am: |
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My first radio room was lined floor to ceiling with accoustic ceiling tile and had deep shag carpeting,no echo there,or background noise,but my wife seldom came in.Bigbob |
Donald_duck
New member
Username: Donald_duck
Post Number: 4
Registered: 8-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, August 27, 2005 - 9:34 pm: |
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I have since resoldered my "clipped" radios. Been the 'in' thing to do for decades. Might be dreaming, but it seemed to over drive the audio in the receive mode, also, when too close to a rig with fire in the wire. This got much better after returning to stock settings. Seems that I do not have to repeat myself as much, as well as receiving more compliments on my clear audio. My ears, (the ones on my head) do not hear as well these days, and over moded radios are getting too hard to understand for the older guys out there.......rOn :-/ |
