| Author |
Message |
    
Freebird
Intermediate Member
Username: Freebird
Post Number: 229
Registered: 1-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 16, 2005 - 10:41 pm: | 
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hey im wondering what is the hardest amp to blow up?I have had Klv palomars ,etc and none of them last to long.I always set my swrs and turn down the wattage too.first off these amps need fans on them and 2nd i think the parts on the inside are not the best.so tell me what amp would be very hard to blow up?..such as brands of amps and how hard you can drive them..later |
Road_warrior
Advanced Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 693
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 12:05 am: |
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I've used the KL amps, palomars ect also
and had no trouble. 2-3 watts DK with
6-8 watts swing is what i used. Some i ran
3 1/2-4 watts DK with no trouble.
Don't know what to tell ya.
In my earlier days i blew a couple of
tube amps by overdriving them.
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Alsworld
Advanced Member
Username: Alsworld
Post Number: 939
Registered: 1-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 12:17 am: |
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Not enough specifics Freebird. What is your deadkey, what do you swing?
Amps need a 1:4 ratio. 25% deadkey equal 100% swing for best performance. If you have been blowing amps, sounds like you have been giving them more than they can handle (obviously) and do not have your radio and amp(s) tuned together very well.
A competition style amp "may" serve your purpose but they need to be setup correctly. Dave Made, Xforce/MagnaForce may suite your needs. There are others. AM only or AM/SSB?
Alsworld |
Ajm1571
Member
Username: Ajm1571
Post Number: 53
Registered: 12-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 2:19 am: |
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i blew up a firebird 500 on ssb..had the ssb switch flipped too, appearantly the galaxy 73 had a little too much power on ssb an when i keyed up...poof went the firebird...lol |
Heavyweight
Junior Member
Username: Heavyweight
Post Number: 16
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 9:15 am: |
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Any amp will blow if you do something stupid like try to key on someone for hours on end! |
Hotwire
Intermediate Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 437
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 10:29 am: |
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Cheap amps can't withstand much over 12 volts. Get an amp with an aluminum or copper board in it. Fatboy amps are good and I believe are good for 18 or more volts. Any amp will die if you abuse it. |
Snowfire
Intermediate Member
Username: Snowfire
Post Number: 116
Registered: 2-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 11:34 am: |
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Alsworld I was told by a radio shop that tuning your radio and amp together was a joke, and that you can take a stock radio out of the box and hook it to any amp and work just fine.
Cef 294 |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 6370
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 11:57 am: |
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Snowfire,
Well now you know how that guys stays busy selling amps to customers that believe that stuff he throws out.
And when they blow the Amp up I bet he says it was a bad amp or the radio was bad but he can FIX it for them. 
And this should also tell you that this is one guy you DO NOT want working on or touching any of your radio equipment.
Personally, I have ALWAYS matched Every Radio to Every Amp and NEVER blown an Amp up yet.
Alsworld is 100% Dead On and Correct on what he posted.
Lon
Tech808
CEF808
N9OSN
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Snowfire
Intermediate Member
Username: Snowfire
Post Number: 117
Registered: 2-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 2:14 pm: |
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Ok that is what I thought, and allway's heard, you must mach a radio to an amp. I have never ran an amp with a stock radio. My radio's have the Dk turned down to 2watt and swing up to what the radio will do. The radio shop I have never used but stoped and looked around a time or two. The radio shop is in the Denton Tx area if anyone want's to know!
I hope my new S9 when it get's here has a low dk and swing's massively.
Cef 294 |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 1066
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 6:59 pm: |
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'I hope my new S9 when it get's here has a low dk and swing's massively.'-it SHOULD, snowfire. just DON'T hook that S9 up to ANY ole amp without doin' a bit of research 1st. S9 + typical amplifier = POOF!
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Capt205
Junior Member
Username: Capt205
Post Number: 19
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 7:11 pm: |
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I have 2 S-9s that dk 1.5watts and I let them swing away to what they will do. One feeds a Palomar Elite 450HD in the mobile, and the other feeds a Palomar 500 Base amp with the built in 35amp power supply. I have no problems with either setup. Nice loud audio from the S-9's, and no issues when the amps are on. |
Snowfire
Intermediate Member
Username: Snowfire
Post Number: 120
Registered: 2-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 10:41 pm: |
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Patzerozero, the amp will be a texas star, not sure how big probly my 500v. Should be a great setup I hope. Have to wait and see.
Cef 294 |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 1076
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, July 17, 2005 - 11:23 pm: |
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500v will work just fine! on either AM or SSB, start by turning mic gain down so radio only swings about 1/2 of normal-don't worry, it won't effect audio. keep turning mic gain up ONLY til amp output does NOT swing any higher. for AM, keep dead key under 4 watts. ask 'chainsawiniowa' how his S9 & DX500V does |
Nickle
Junior Member
Username: Nickle
Post Number: 28
Registered: 5-2005
| | Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 1:24 pm: |
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i've got a powersourse 250 mobile that my galaxy 2517 could not hurt. we tried all day the amp won. |
Bigbob
Senior Member
Username: Bigbob
Post Number: 2050
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Monday, July 18, 2005 - 6:32 pm: |
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Hmmm,sounds like you're not using enough C-4,Nickle.Seriously though,with enough padding at the input you can make any amp bullet-proof,I saw a metal box at my former tech's shop that had an L-Pad in it made with a bunch of air cooled dummy loads hooked in series to act as resistors rather than loads,they were 25 watt units,he said it was an experiment to see if he could make a pad to remove enough rf from a 100 watt txer to drive a small amp,he said it worked but was not practical.Bigbob |
Wolverine
Intermediate Member
Username: Wolverine
Post Number: 393
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 5:19 am: |
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Magnaforce Amps are my choice. The X-Force 200HD, can take a 5 to 6 watt dead key. Both amps are stout.
Wolverine. |
Jburner
Junior Member
Username: Jburner
Post Number: 17
Registered: 3-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 9:04 am: |
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The hardest amp to blow.....the one I haven't bought yet, but give me time. |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 6379
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 9:33 am: |
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Jburner,
Good Man!
I always live by the slogan:
IF ANYTHING CAN GO WRONG IT WILL GO WRONG!
Lon
Tech808
CEF808
N9OSN |
Allagator
Advanced Member
Username: Allagator
Post Number: 663
Registered: 9-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 4:10 pm: |
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hey ive fried a amp ! LOL
hooked it up backwards ! LOL
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Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 1078
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, July 19, 2005 - 4:52 pm: |
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believe it or not, wolverine, the x40, x80, x200, x400, xt400, & magna & davemade equivalents are rated to handle ONLY 35 watts peak. most radios are fine with that. my pre-tuned S9 was fine with my davemade m400, after tuning & getting REAL 42+ pep the dave sounded funky, so have to back down on the mic gain with it. YOU CAN BLOW THEM UP! |
Wolverine
Intermediate Member
Username: Wolverine
Post Number: 395
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 20, 2005 - 3:26 am: |
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Patzerozero, check out their website. The 2 pill and 4 pill amps Magna, and X-force can take way more than 35 peak imputs. Now the "Hot boxes" you named (Amps with driver pills in them), like the x-200, x-400, and xt-400 may be limited to a 35 peak imput.
Wolverine. |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 1081
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Wednesday, July 20, 2005 - 8:24 am: |
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yes, the x-- amps are the ones with drivers & are limited to 35 watts PEP. even the x80 a 2 x 2290 amp will take only 35 pep (& davemade suggests LESS, though on website says 40...)
the 200 & 400, 2x2879 & 4x 2879 suggest in print they will handle 120 & 240 PEP respectively, but when you speak to them they suggest LESS. (example:the 200 requires LESS then 7 watts carrier drive & it's HIGHLY unlikely ANYTHING with 7 watts carrier & 120 watts swing is gonna sound 1/2 way decent, so on the other hand the assumption is that 120 watts PEP has more then 7 watts carrier &.....more mumbo-jumbo.) so basically, 4-5-6-7 watts carrier from a magnum topgun radio with 45 watts PEP & that 2x2879 will probably key 125-150 & swing 350+. not bad for 2 2sc2879's, huh? but when 'newbies' read that & try to key their texas star dx350 with an S9 & get smoke.... |
Wally38
Junior Member
Username: Wally38
Post Number: 13
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Thursday, July 21, 2005 - 1:46 am: |
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So, what is the best linear amp to use with the Magnum S9? I just bought my Magnum S9 and would like to get an amp for it someday.
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Wolverine
Intermediate Member
Username: Wolverine
Post Number: 396
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 21, 2005 - 3:54 am: |
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Rats, lost another one to "Geiko". LOL. Thanks Pat for the info, as it applies to newbies, and printed specs when less swing imput is warranted. The S-9 radio is probably better suited, and will drive a straight 4- pill 2879 amp perfectly. What's that old cliche', "Don't believe the hype".
Wolverine. |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 6395
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, July 21, 2005 - 7:05 am: |
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Wally38,
The post below also Includes the Magnum S-9 / S-6 Radios.
Posted on Friday, January 16, 2004 - 6:47 pm:
-------------------------------------------------
The Following tips are Direct from Sam Lewis at RF Limited and Designed to give you 100% use of your Radio's when using an Amplifier with them.
Owner's of the NEW OMEGA FORCE S-45 and the MAGNUM S-3 Radio's, and other Radio's that will be using the TOP GUN BOARD, need to read the Following Owner's Tip's.
TIP #1
AMPLIFIER USE with the NEW TOP GUN BOARD!
NOTICE!
These Radio's were NOT designed to be used with 2 Pill Amplifiers!
These New Radio's with the NEW TOP GUN BOARD'S are designed to be used with an AMPLIFIER that has at Least 4-2879's or more, that need's NO Driver / Exciter Stage.
The Ideal Amplifier for use with the Omega Force S-45 or Magnum S-3 is the Texas Star 500 with 4- 2SC2879's. With NO DRIVER / EXCITER Stage.
These Radio's with the TOP GUN BOARD were designed to eliminate the need or use of a Driver / Exciter.
For use with other Amplifier's that Use a Driver/Exciter such as the Texas Star 667 that uses 1-SC2290 driving 4-2SC2879's you need to READ the following instructions.
Be Very careful that the Power to the Driver / Exciter is set to NO more than 4 watts and NO More than 12 watts PEP.
Otherwise you will have too much Gain going into the Driver.
It is highly recommended that you have a Professional Set these adjustments for you.
These Tip’s are to help you achieve Top Performance and help you to avoid any problem's that may arise.
As Sam continues to inform me of additional Tip's / Trick's on the RF Limited Product's, I will be posting them for the Owner's of these New radio's.
Hope this helps,
Lon
Tech808
CEF808
N9OSN |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 6398
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, July 21, 2005 - 8:35 am: |
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Ok Folk's,
Guess I will throw my 2 cents in here.
I guess I would have to say it is HARD to blow ANY Amplifier up if you are operating it correctly and Not over driving it and have it installed correctly and matched to the radio.
We have a KL-300 that has been used every day for over 2-1/2 years now and no problems.
Our KL-60 has been going strong on our Uniden PC-78 for almost 3 years and No Problems also used daily.
Our KL-40 hooked to Cobra 20 XTR again NO problems.
Our KLV-1000 is over 2 years old now and No Problems except replacing tubes.
I would say 98% of the problems that people have with amplifiers Base or Mobile are Improper Use, Over Driving them, Bad Jumpers, Bad Antennas, Bad Grounds, Operator Error or Improper Installation.
None of which are the Amplifiers fault.
If you have an amplifier and it does not give you the power you want and you want more Power don't crank the power up in the radio just get a Bigger Amp.
Just my 2 cents worth,
Lon
Tech808
CEF808
N9OSN |
Wolverine
Intermediate Member
Username: Wolverine
Post Number: 397
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Thursday, July 21, 2005 - 8:54 am: |
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Tech 808, I'm informed by reading some posts on the S-9 (In this and other forums), that operation of the top gun feature on the S-9 will make you sound either fuzzy, or that you won't be able to tell the difference whether the top gun feature is on or off. Is this a design flaw?, or can this be due to operator error?, being close to another's receiver?, amp being over/underdriven?, or the amp not being matched to the S-9? etc. This Top Gun feature is supposed to be the newest revolutionary idea, as far as industry radio innovations. Thanx.
Wolverine. |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 6403
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, July 21, 2005 - 5:41 pm: |
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Wolverine,
There is no design flaw in the Top Gun Modulator.
But there is Human / Operator error in operating a radio with the Top Gun Modulator.
While the Top Gun Modulator will increase your out put power if someone is Close to you say within 5 to 10 miles it does sound kind of fuzzy/distorted.
And if someone is closer than that it tends to overload their receive.
When Jaybird_od CEF #557 and Wrongway CEF #113 come thru every night when they are about 5 or so miles out they will turn the Top Gun off.
As they sound Fuzzy/Distorted to myself, Turtle #165, Corncob #166, Homeboy #159 and Redman #156 with it on and we are on our base station antennas.
When they are about 5 or 10 miles out of town they will turn it back on and we have had them up to 60 miles away 100% clear.
If you are talking Local there just is NO reason to use the Top Gun Modulator or you will overload many of the local radios and sound fuzzy/distorted to them.
When we drive to KY we will not turn it on until we are several miles out of town and then it just Flat WALKS THE DOG!
On our last KY Trip we had the top gun on and was talking with Wrongway with his S-9 and our S-45 coming from IN about 25 - 30 miles away and then when we started getting fuzzy to each other we both turned it off and no problems then when we passed on I-74 we waited for about 5 or 10 minutes and turned it back on and talked until we had about 20-25 miles between us.
Some people tend to think that just because a radio has every feature there is that they need to use them all the time.
Sorry but that is just not the case.
Lon
Tech808
CEF808
N9OSN |
Johnhenre
Member
Username: Johnhenre
Post Number: 74
Registered: 1-2004
| | Posted on Thursday, July 21, 2005 - 8:37 pm: |
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HI; TO ALL JUST STOPPED IN TO READ A LITTLE AND SEE WHAT WAS HAPPENING IN THIS AMP.SECTION, And WHAT LITTLE I KNOW ABOUT THEM MOST OF YOU ARE RIGHT.ABOUT DRIVEING AMP'S.BUT MOSTLY VOLTAGE WILL KILL ONE DEAD QUICK,AND BEING LONG WINDED,I'VE HAD ABOUT EVER PILL AMP.BUILT AND HAVE AFTER AROUND ABOUT (100) OR MORE PILL'S THAT (I) BLEW GAVE UP.AND FIGURED OUT THERE LIKE WAL? ITEM'S (MASS PRODUCED). SO LEARN TO BUILD THEM ON YOU (OWN).UNDERSTAND THEM AND IF YOU GET IT TO PRODUCE AT 15VDC AND YOU CAN HAMMER ON IT ENDLESS AND RUN (COOL)WITH GOOD CLEAR AUDIO,+++ WATTS,PULLING LESS AMP'S. YOUR POCKET BOOK WILL GET A LOT FATTER. JUST 2 CENTS. 2X4X8 JOHN |
Bigbob
Senior Member
Username: Bigbob
Post Number: 2062
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Thursday, July 21, 2005 - 9:39 pm: |
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Just what does the top gun modulator consist of,what are it's main components.Bigbob |
Wolverine
Intermediate Member
Username: Wolverine
Post Number: 398
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 22, 2005 - 5:59 am: |
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Wow, you could hear them 60 miles away!!, So the magic formula is to use the 10 mile or above limit, before you activate the top gun modulator board, otherwise you will overload someone's receiver. Fair enough.
Wolverine. |
Deceived1
New member
Username: Deceived1
Post Number: 8
Registered: 6-2005
| | Posted on Friday, July 22, 2005 - 9:12 am: |
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Texas Star 667V driving it with a HR-2510 works great never skips a beat my mobile setup. Base setup i have a KLV-1000P driving it with a RCI-6900/F150 no Smoke no Fire.  |
Wolverine
Intermediate Member
Username: Wolverine
Post Number: 400
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Friday, July 22, 2005 - 9:17 am: |
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Bigbob, click on the subcriber (Preview) section of the forum, then click on product reviews, then scroll down until you see the S-9 radio review, click on that and you're set. The review will answer all of your questions, as well as the specifications, pros and cons of the radio. Hope this helps.
Wolverine. |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 1084
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, July 22, 2005 - 2:02 pm: |
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wally38, the texas star dx500, a dave/x/magna 4 pill or dave/x 5pill all work well with the topgun 45 watt magnums. JUST START LOW & WORK UP FROM THERE! don't start on high key & full swing... |
Bigbob
Senior Member
Username: Bigbob
Post Number: 2068
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Friday, July 22, 2005 - 10:08 pm: |
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Wolverine,my question was the only one not answered in the review,it was a non-technical review and my Q.is highly technical,heck the answer may be a copyright violation or at the very least a patent breach and copper may not be at liberty to show it.Bigbob |
Wolverine
Intermediate Member
Username: Wolverine
Post Number: 405
Registered: 2-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, July 23, 2005 - 9:31 am: |
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Bigbob, sorry for the inconvenience. Tech 808 appears to be a big proponent for the featured Top gun circuitry, and maybe he can give you the technical answer that you require, other wise, the CB tricks website may shed some info. Hope this helps.
Wolverine. |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 6424
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, July 23, 2005 - 11:37 am: |
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Bigbob,
Sorry but I have no idea what the components are in the Top Gun Modulator or CP1 board.
And yes they are both Trade Marked / Copyrighted by Magnum International.
Sam is very touchy about the Top Gun Modulator and the CP1 as there are many out there trying to copy them.
I can only post what information Sam supplies me with or what I actually find when doing the Reviews.
Sorry, not much help here on this question
Lon
Tech808
CEF808
N9OSN |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 6425
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, July 23, 2005 - 11:58 am: |
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Wolverine,
While the Top Gun Modulator is nice feature 99.9% of the time the only place/time we use it on our S-3 / S-45 is when we are travelling for bear reports or accident reports.
Other than that it is never even turned on.
And our Magnum 257 and S-3200B does not even have it.
Lon
Tech808
CEF808
N9OSN
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Therealporkchop
Intermediate Member
Username: Therealporkchop
Post Number: 256
Registered: 11-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, July 23, 2005 - 2:19 pm: |
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The hardest amp to blow up is the one hooked up to a radio that is set up for it. Being operated by someone who knows how to run the radio and amp in the first place... |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 1097
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, July 25, 2005 - 6:30 pm: |
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bigbob, a very basic answer to your question, & this is only AN ASSUMPTION that is being speculated on by some of the bigger proponents of the topgun radios here & elsewhere is that the 2 separate boards that make up the 'topgun' circuitry are 1-a pretty well designed, thought out & tuned speech compressor & 2-also a pretty well designed, thought out and tuned 'swing kit'. after all, how many radios have you EVER heard key 1 watt, swing 40 watts & sound good??? not many if any at all! so the circuitry works, & apparently does not take well to adjustments.
for the record, when i do use my S9, it is keying FULL POWER, nearly 12 watts swinging 40+. it is LOUD & it sounds good. on my davemade, i back carrier down to about 3 & mic gain down til swing is about 35 at its HIGHEST. keys 250 & swings over 900.
WHATEVER the topgun circuitry may be, works! |
Bigbob
Senior Member
Username: Bigbob
Post Number: 2077
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Monday, July 25, 2005 - 7:09 pm: |
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OK. |
Elmert
New member
Username: Elmert
Post Number: 1
Registered: 10-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 26, 2005 - 11:33 pm: |
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I have a magnum S9 driving X-Force 200HD, It dead key's 1 watt swinging 40watt. I have been using it for about 9 months with no problems. It will swing up to 350 watts. It seems to really get out on ssb. I have it in a old pickup with a 102" steel whip antenna. I never thought about it smoking the amp. I wonder how long It will last. Thanks for the info. I am new on the forum. |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 1775
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, October 28, 2005 - 3:59 pm: |
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most of the custom built amps, x force included ARE DESIGNED to handle large amounts of SWING input. the commercially made units are not. that's the reason your x force is still kicking with 40+ watts input SWING. as long as swr's are LOW & fan is cranking, it'll be fine. try that with a 2 x 2879 texas star or other amp & it'll smoke sooner rather then later |
