| Author |
Message |
    
Wildrat
Advanced Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 750
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Friday, February 03, 2006 - 2:22 pm: | 
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Before anyone says get a polyphaser, I have them. We are having very severe lightning today. I was driving in the storms and one bolt struck so close I felt the concussion and the hair on my arms stood up. I saw other strikes and you could see the steam and crackling as the strike was happening. I went ahead and disconnected my coaxes from the radio's and had them hanging there. I had an idea of taking a couple of 259 bulkhead connectors and mounting them to a piece of aluminum, soldering a wire in the center and attaching it to the aluminum plate also and then have a piece of solid copper ground wire go outside to a ground rod. Has anyone done this? It sounds like a good idea to me. Tell me if it's not.
Mark |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1222
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, February 03, 2006 - 6:24 pm: |
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Presently mine is set up sort of like that, but, everything is outside away from house.
My coax stays outside during thunderstorms and
i hide in the closet...LOL...
It's not a good idea to let you coax hang around
the inside of your house or placing coax in
a glass jar. You can lose your home to fire.
I read somewhere that it's possible for a million volts to race through the coax. So, it's important to have all your grounds set-up correctly.I can not tell you if your idea
is good or bad. But, personally i wouldn't do it.
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Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1192
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, February 04, 2006 - 8:40 am: |
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If you already have Polyphasers inline, then the center of your coaxes are disconnected. Doing as you suggest (the centers grounded via a plate) will do nothing since the centers are 'open' to lightning anyway. May as well just stay on the air and laugh at all the guys that had to shut down so their coax could hide in a glass jar. |
Wildrat
Advanced Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 758
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, February 04, 2006 - 9:50 am: |
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I was hoping you would chime in 833. The storms here yesterday were hellacious. This is my first experience with Polyphasers and I was just a bit nervous about leaving the coaxes connected. Lightning is peculiar and I know it is predictable contrary to old wives tales but I did not want my equip. finding out otherwise, if you know what I mean. I know that with the PP's that the center is open, and I know the antenna side has that big hunk of aluminum and copper going straight to ground but it's still scary. I mean when the hair on your arms are standing up from electricity in the air and you see steam and crackling around the bolt as it's striking it's close and a bit unsettling.
I have also affected one local fella here though. When the storms came in he called me and asked me about the PP's and asked me what to do for now with his coaxes. I told him I had mine disconnected out of nervousness and that they were hanging there and that was not a good idea either if the lightning decided to pay a visit. He did tell me he had his jar there but he was not going to put the coaxes in the jar after listening to me on the radio. So 1 out of 20 or more listened. |
Marconi
Advanced Member
Username: Marconi
Post Number: 586
Registered: 11-2001
| | Posted on Saturday, February 04, 2006 - 8:12 pm: |
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I wonder about that little gap in the PP's also Wildrat. If the RF jumps that littel gap all the time with the radio working then why doesn't the big old lightning jump that little gap also as it rumbles down the feed line towards the rig. What makes that big old bolt of lightning jump and possibly make a 90 degree turn to get off into the shorting section to ground inside of that PP unit.
I believe I would rather have my coax outside 10'-15' feet away from the house, plugged into a bulkhead that was well grounded instead of having to really depend on a very little 1/32" air/gas gap in an inline device; unless this device is also outside near the antenna and sitting right on the top of a very good grounding system.
I'm not up on these things, so I could be wrong, you think? I'm from Missouri, you almost have to show me, before I will believe some of these claims. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1223
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, February 05, 2006 - 12:19 am: |
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Polyphasers are recommended by alot of people.
And from what i read, Polyphasers are the best
lightning protection available. I agree.
But, doesn't this depend on how well your
ground system is set up. To spread the energy
out enough to where little energy comes down
your coax. Having your coax grounded to your
tower at several points and having the correct
size copper strap,amount of ground-rods and other devices installed.
How many CBers actually have such a system?
I hear people say they have 1 ground-rod for
lightning protection/ 1 ground-rod for station
ground and using #6 wire. If all that lightning energy were to come down the coax instead of
spreading out because of a poor designed ground system and your talking on your CB during
a severe Thunderstorm. Have fun!
I would like to see a well written article on
the forum explaining proper lightning grounding.
Yes, i know there is different posts on the
subject on the forum. But, i think a well written article would provide more understanding.
And i know time is an issue for alot of you
and thats understandable.
Laugh at me for having my coax outside, but, at
least i'm showing common sense and admitting i
don't know if my ground system is designed well
enough to take the chance.
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Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1194
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, February 05, 2006 - 1:10 am: |
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As long as your Polyphasers are grounded better than your radios, the lighning will not pass to the radios. Path of least resistance, etc.
Marconi, I understand. However, this is one time you will have to take someone's word on it. I can't show you. If you decide to disagree, that's O.K. with me. |
Dinker1
Intermediate Member
Username: Dinker1
Post Number: 142
Registered: 1-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, February 05, 2006 - 6:32 am: |
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Ive never heard of all the things above and i am not from Mo. but near,nothing to be ashamed of, all ive ever done is disconnect and put in a heavy soda bottle, mine is a rccola about 40 years old, that is what we old timers done back when,,,DEAN- |
Wildrat
Advanced Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 761
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, February 05, 2006 - 11:30 am: |
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Dinker get rid of the bottle to start, if you get a hit you will be picking glass out your ***.
A polyphaser will direct lightning bolt to ground if installed correctly. I am not knowledgeable enough to go in to detail on them. 833 tells us this is what the big stations use to protect their equipment, he is a engineer so I will believe him. I have read the info at Polyphasers web site and it all sound s good. Every one around here thought my antenna would get hit because of all the grounding I have on it. Well we had some terrible lightning here this week and I'm still here, so because I am grounded well did not cause me to be more attractive to the lightning. |
Hotwire
Advanced Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 864
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, February 05, 2006 - 2:05 pm: |
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Ya know the old legend about the coax in a glass jar trick would be a great suggestion to send to Mythbusters on the Discovery channel. |
Moonraker
Intermediate Member
Username: Moonraker
Post Number: 148
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, February 05, 2006 - 9:14 pm: |
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Maybe if we all sent mythbusters an e-mail, they might test it...or not |
Unit199
Intermediate Member
Username: Unit199
Post Number: 234
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Sunday, February 05, 2006 - 10:45 pm: |
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I will say again, "THE ONLY WAY TO BE REASONABLY SAFE IS, TAKE COAX LOOSE AND PUT OUTSIDE, NEXT UNPLUG EVERYTHING AND UNDO GROUND. THERE IS NOTHING MADE ON THIS MAN'S EARTH THAT WILL SAVE YOUR EQUIPMENT IF YOU TAKE A HIT. THEY CAN TALK UP THE PP'S OR WHATEVER AND THEY ARE NOT GOING TO SAVE YOUR ***!!!" I was involved with a group that tested all these so called gadgets and I can tell you that the manufacturers of these gadgets are laughing all the way to the bank. You can discuss this all you want, but these are the cold hard facts.
HARVE
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Rldrake
Member
Username: Rldrake
Post Number: 51
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Sunday, February 05, 2006 - 11:19 pm: |
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While glass jars have a relatively high resistance and are quite good insulators for many hundreds of volts...they will not insulate anything from the potential of many, many Giga volts of electricity. Nor does any "polyphaser" or similar device. No hand held device is going to redirect a astronomical high amperage arc of electricity with a voltage of many, many Giga volts. Such an arc (lighening) that has just jumped a high resistance air gap of a mile or so is going to be rerouted by such a tiny device. A real, direct strike would vaporize it and continue on it's course. Such a device can easily be made into a glob of trash even with a typical arc welder. (Note: the welding rod needs to touch metal to start an arc...not enough voltage to jump an air gap). Same arc welder can easily make mush of small surface area grounding cables and rods. (Note: the temperature of a lightening bolt is many times that of the surface of the Sun). Such devices are effective for bleeding off nearby corona charges and static electricity created by dry blowing air (wind & dust), sand and snow....not Gigavoltage, high amperage arcs with the electrical potential (voltage) to travel an air gap of many miles. (Note: An automobile's spark plug typically requires 30,000 volts to jump a gap of 35/1000ths of an inch). |
Chad
Advanced Member
Username: Chad
Post Number: 682
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, February 06, 2006 - 9:11 am: |
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ALL the commercial radio stations use them. After installing Polyphasers at a local plant I have yet to repair a Marti, STL, or remote from a lightning strike, they must be doing something.
They DO work, most of the Naysayers have not had enough expierience with them. They have saved Millions of dollars all over the world at plants and in amatuer rigs. It may not be 100% effective but they have made my life TONS easier.
Chad |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 2386
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, February 06, 2006 - 5:47 pm: |
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the ICE arrestor has been what i've used since about 93 or so. i was directed to them by an engineer from an LI radio station. they used to specifically state that no damage to equipment from a DIRECT STRIKE had ever been recorded. i can't seem to find that on the web anymore, though i do have a technical sheet from 1999 that says such.
the engineer who led me there told me it is more about removing the static build up from the air(that feeling of hair standing on end people report prior to being struck-i know several survivors, including a baseball TEAM from my HS years ago that were ALL struck)and redirecting(wrong word?) a direct strike, rather then absorbing it. if the 'static' was dissippated to ground, the chances of a strike to THAT object would be lessened. the energy would then find another route to ground nearby, & while your antenna may be vaporized by the residual effects, this ICE arrestor would keep the residual energy from reaching your equipment.
i have not a clue if it is any better then the polyphaser, glass jar, or nothing at all. mine's been there for about 14 years or so. my antenna longer, so i doubt it's ever taken even a residual hit. i doubt i would even swap it out for a polyphaser, but it would be interesting to hear of other non-biased opinions. maybe 833, marconi or Rldrake would care to offer opinion? |
Chad
Advanced Member
Username: Chad
Post Number: 683
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Monday, February 06, 2006 - 8:07 pm: |
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I am a survivor too, twice over, almost three times.
First was on a bicycle tour, Got me in the back, blew EVERY spoke off the bike and sprained a wrist from the fall. No ill effects on that one.
Second (close one) it tore a new sunroof in my car that had no sunroof, totaled the car, I bought it back and installed.... A sunroof! And repaired the electrical system.
The last time was fairly recent, about 3 years ago. The storm was "over" I was unloading gear from the back of my truck. It bounced off the neighbors tree and got me between the shoulder blades. The blast threw me over the bed of the truck into my front yard. I took off running out of adrenaline. I thought I was being attacked! It wasn't till I saw the blood coming from under my fingernails and smelled smoking skin did I realize what happened. I drove myself to the ER and went on a heart monitor for what seemed forever. It was summer, I was sweaty and I think the skin conductance saved my life. That one affected me a bit. My hair turned grey at 30, I now look 10 years older than I am. I suffer VERY short term memory loss, not like Marijuana effects but as in I'll loose myself in a sentence. Long term is OK. I have learned to cope with the memory loss, just a "brain re-routing" and in the past year I feel normal, very rarely do I see the effects. I now have 2 patches of hair on my shoulder blades to remind me, prolly scar tissue.
The rotty was with me. If a storm is approaching that you can't even see or hear he will (violently if he has to) heard me into the house. Changed him for life too!
I don't recommend it but it makes some great bar-room conversation.
Now... Who wants to go golfing in spring with me? (I don't golf but I thought I'd see if there are any takers)
Chad
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Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1227
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, February 06, 2006 - 11:19 pm: |
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I'll go golfing with you Chad. But, i'm
bringing 6" Copper Straps, Golf bag full
of grounding rods, box full of polyphasers
and a Turbo charged golf cart for quick get-away!
LOL.... |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1198
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 12:28 am: |
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With all due respect, Harve and RLdrake are speading false information. I beg posters, please refrain from saying things that are unresearched and/or untrue. It makes those of us WITH hands-on experience have to jump through too many extra hoops to disprove you over and over and over.
BTW, the general rule of thumb is it takes 7,000 volts to jump 1 inch in air. |
Rldrake
Member
Username: Rldrake
Post Number: 54
Registered: 1-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 1:24 am: |
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The ICE products, as well as about a dozen others, are very good products as are the Polyphasers. But, their pupose is to PREVENT a direct strike...not to alter the course of one. Attempting such is like trying to alter the course of a river with a pick-up truck load of sandbags. Even if these "lightening protectors" could divert a direct strike, almost all modern electronic equipment, such as radios, computers,etc, will be likely destroyed, (particularly magnetic drives, microprocessors, optical encoders/decoders, and all types of displays highly vulnerable) or at best severely damaged, by the intense magnetic field of a real direct strike. High electrical currents (amperage) produce very, very intense magnetic fields. Scientists and experimenters have actually measured such currents (amps) utilizing test towers for just this purpose. These test structures are relatively highly resistive in nature when considering the voltages involved...yet amperages actually measured are typically 50,000 AMPS (not volts, amps). Odds are that they have never come close to actually observing the most severe of strikes.
As Chad pointed out...Yes, commercial broadcast stations (radio & TV) are all using "lightening protection systems"...as do amateur and land moble repeaters...many are indeed using Polyphasers (and others). Here, again, they are attempting to, and quite sucessfully, prevent a direct strike. However, it is not unusual for a commercial station to go off the air due to damage from a direct strike...or even a nearby strike. Many commercial stations have a back-up transmitter site so that they can get back on the air until the damage at the primary site is repaired. Polyphaser (and others) are common on typical FM, local AM, and TV stations. At the big boy, 50,000 watt, Class A, AM stations (KOA Denver, WLS & WGN Chicago, WWL New Orleans, etc.)...you are going to find "lightening protection systems" engineered and installed by outfits such as General Electric, Westinghouse, Motorola, Harvey Wells, Watkins-Johnson, Rockwell Collins, and Harris RF.
No matter how good the "lightening protection", nobody in the industry can guarantee, absolutely, that they can protect a transmitter site from severe lightening damage. This is why the commercial stations carry insurance coverage for lightening damage.
They all are trying to prevent a direct strike by "bleeding off" the corona or the "streamers" that preclude a direct strike. |
Tech808
Moderator
Username: Tech808
Post Number: 9207
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 2:20 am: |
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Sorry folks but NO MYTHS or RUMORS here just the FACTS!
We have had 3 PolyPhasers installed here at our home since I did the Review with Tech833 on the PolyPhasers.
One each for the Vertical and Horizontal coax of the MACO M103-HV and one on the coax for the IMAX 2000.
We only had one 100% POSITIVE way to test them and we wished that would never happen.
I was VERY Wrong as during one of the Sunday CEF Nets less than 4 months after installing them, we did receive a DIRECT hit to the IMAX, which blew it to pieces and welded/melted the pl259 to the base of the imax and mast pipe.
The PolyPhasers DID save Shirley and I and ALL six of our radios and the equipment that I had connected at the time to the MFJ-1700B switch with NO DAMAGE to the equipment or myself and Shirley who was talking on the radio at the time.
When Hal / Moderator136 was here for a visit from IA. He saw ALL of the damage and the melted spots on the tower from the direct hit where the Imax was bolted to the mast and the mast to the tower.
Where the lightning hit the base of the Imax it made the 1-1/2" pipe and Imax base and pl259 look like a giant melted GLOB of metal.
Do we still use them? YES!
Will we continue to use them? YES!
Will we recommend them to anyone who wants to feel SAFE when they are installed correctly? YES!
Do we feel 100% SAFE that they will continue to protect our Equipment and us? YES!
NOTE! We did replace the one that was connected to the IMAX.
Will we ever listen to rumors and waste our time to unhook 4 runs of coax or stop talking during a Lightning storm? NO!
A person can listen to any of the rumors that everyone has to spread but WE have the FACTS and the PROOF and the FACTS and PROOF are from our First Hand knowledge of what the PolyPhaser's will and will not do when we got a DIRECT HIT.
And after getting a direct hit during the CEF Nets with Shirley and I talking on the radio and both of us less than 18 inches from the coax coming into the house when we did get hit is enough proof for us that the PolyPhaser's did their job and they DO WORK!
And as soon as the IS-50UX-C1 PolyPhaser arrives it will be installed on our Anttron 2/6-meter antenna.
Shirley and I enjoy talking on the radio no matter what the conditions are and without worries that is what we do and we let the PolyPhasers do what they were designed to do PROTECT us and OUR Radio Equipment. 
And while some of you will be running around hunting for glass jars or unhooking coax we will just KEEP ON  and making CEF Contacts. 
Lon
Tech808
CEF808
N9CEF 
&
Shirley
1st Sargant
CEF164
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Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1201
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 9:49 am: |
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Good story Lon.
No matter how many times you tell that story, some people simply will not hear it. I have been pushing correct grounding practices here, including installation of Polyphasers, for how many years now? All it takes is one person to post something contrary and it seems to un-do about a full year's worth of effort.
You are correct, facts are facts. The whole CB folklore thing is still new to me, and I am constantly surprised how much faith people give the voodoo folklore. Perhaps it is just a CB tradition, perhaps it is the fact that so many of our elders (whom we are to respect) are the ones spreading the folklore. It continues to be a culture shock to me.
Maybe this is an opportunity for Copper to assemble a complete grounding 'kit', along with pictures of your installation and your well written story, Lon. Copper could bundle up a ground rod, some ground wire, strap, clamps, Polyphaser, lugs, Penetrox, etc. I am certain the margin would be worthwhile. So... How about it F.M.? |
Hotwire
Advanced Member
Username: Hotwire
Post Number: 873
Registered: 1-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 10:27 am: |
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Dog gonnit! Anyone seen my glass jar?
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Wildrat
Advanced Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 763
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 4:50 pm: |
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Some people are the problem! They are very knowledgeable but they don't know everything, so they start speaking without knowing. Some of us know a little about electricity, myself having been an aircraft electrician. I want to believe in the ability of the polyPhaser. I trust what 833 tells me on this forum because i have read his other post and what he says about them is true. Another question is "Why is Polyphaser still in business selling this item plus many other items to protect equipment if they were not doing what they were suppose to do?" What scares me is when someone on the forum that like to to honk their horn by writing long thesis about nothing, and scaring the Krap out of us operators. When I was putting my station together around here some of the locals were running their mouths about all my grounding I did. I have 8 ground rods in the ground for my radios, tower, and antenna, and then there is a whole bunch of ground wire buried around here. Then all that is tied into the houses ground system, two more ground rods, and it is tied into the ground for the swimming pool. The naysayers around here said I was a target for the lightning. We down here in Clearwater and the Tampa Bay area just went thru that hellacious storm last week which started this posting in the first place because of certain people causing me to lose confidence in the science behind the Polyphasers. I am going to do what 833 told me to do talk and laugh. Talk and Laugh! Now I've forgot what I was on about, so I will stop now.
Mark
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Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1205
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 6:22 pm: |
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Having all that grounding does NOT make you a better target, it will help drain the static from your system, which will actually help steer the lightning away from you.
A lightning strike begins with static buildup. If you never let the static build up in the first place, you will not receive a strike. The more, the better in this case. |
Moonraker
Intermediate Member
Username: Moonraker
Post Number: 151
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 7:48 pm: |
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I have heard from one of the local hams that it is a good idea to take a SO-239 connector with the shield soldered to the center conductor and plug your coax into this during a lightning storm.
Rldrake wrote:
"They all are trying to prevent a direct strike by "bleeding off" the corona or the "streamers" that preclude a direct strike."
Does this mean that an antenna with the So-239 (as described above) would actually reduce the chances of being struck by bleeding off the corona? I thought the antenna (the radiating element) would be more likely to be struck if was grounded out by SO-239. Was I wrong?
Also, antennas like the A99 & Imax 2000 will show a direct short if the shield and center conductor is tested with an ohm meter. Does this make them more susceptible to lightning?
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Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 2390
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 8:08 pm: |
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'A lightning strike begins with static buildup. If you never let the static build up in the first place, you will not receive a strike. The more, the better in this case.'-which is what was explained to me regarding the ICE arrestor.
so, 833, not to push 1 over the other, IS this piece from ICE the same, better or worse then the polyphaser. (they do have a website explaining why THEIRS is better.) since i use one, i'm curious.... |
Unit199
Intermediate Member
Username: Unit199
Post Number: 235
Registered: 8-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 08, 2006 - 3:20 am: |
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I am going to say something that some people will not like, but they are not the all knowing, and if you don't agree with them then you are lying and don't know what you are talking about. I have a little knowledge about lightning as I was a broadcast engineer for several years. I know that you can't protect yourself from a direct lightning hit. Lon was just lucky he didn't lose his equipment if he took a direct hit. There is a lot of factors involved in helping protect yourself in a direct hit. I doubt that most of you even have the proper grounding. Did they tell you that to ground your system properly that you need several ground radials at leat 50ft long with grounding rods at least every 8ft or less along the groundplanes and that your soil content comes into the picture. Aso did they tell you that your tower or pole you have your antennas on should be at least 20ft or more from your equipment? I could go on and on about this but I am lying and don't know what Iam talking about. YOU CAN JUDGE FOR YOURSELF WHETHER OR NOT I HAVE A LITTLE KNOWLEDGE ABOUT THIS SUBJECT FROM WHAT LITTLE I HAVE WRITTEN. I COULD POST MORE, BUT I WILL NOT CONFUSE ANYBODY WITH ALL THE TECHNICAL JARGON INVOLVED AND IT WOULD BE HARD TO SAY IT SO EVERYONE COULD UNDERSTAND. BTW, I AM NOT A LIAR AND I DON'T APPRECIATE BEING CALLED ONE. HAVE A NICE DAY.
HARVE
KBOYVK
CEF210 |
Wildrat
Advanced Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 766
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Wednesday, February 08, 2006 - 8:43 am: |
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I do not believe any one called you a liar sir. I believe what was said is there are people out here that are very knowledgeable but they don't know everything. Have a nice day. The post on lightning on this forum are on here for all to read. The things you said about distance and radials and ground rods have been covered in other post. What you are reading here and what got my post started is the end of a complete installation of my station from start to finish. You will find postings on lightning, polyphasers, grounding in other peoples postings, as well as mine, which I tried to keep a record here for others getting into this lifestyle can read, and there is Sinkers postings as well, another fella new to radio, and he had lots of questions also. I, Myself did set my station up according to proper installation techniques, at least as well as I could considering some monetary, physical, and geographical constraints I had to stay within. My backyard, and the sides of my house are full of copper now, my tower is at the other end of my house, etc, etc, etc. I also did not just read postings here and leave it there, I asked others, I used the internet to research some of this info. So you see I did not just throw an antenna in the air, catch the end of the coax and hook it to my radio and go. Some of the fellas out here may not have there systems like mine, mine is not like some others out here, but we are learning, and we are striving for a good setup, and most of us out here know what lightning can do. So anyway I'm tired. |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1206
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 9:50 am: |
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Harve,
Slow down a minute! Like you, I am also a broadcast engineer. I have been all my life. I have built AM, FM, SW, and TV stations all over the world, including deep, deep jungles abroad and even some very urban areas of the US. I am currently the Chief Engineer of 9 stations and an ownership partner in 4 others. I do NOT have a CB radio installed at my station, I am here as a broadcast professional too. Now, with all that feather ruffling out of the way, can we continue?
Nobody called you a 'liar'. The only thing disputed in the other thread was your statement that lightning cannot be avoided, etc. That is the only part that is untrue. Many, many knowledgeable professional engineers like us will tell you that is incorrect. In fact, rather than keep your information hidden, would you please take a little time and fully describe the grounding scheme you briefly touched on above? It would make for good reading and would benefit all of us.
No, I am not at all saying that anyone here believes they are 'smarter' than you or anyone else. Nobody here has any big ego to worry about, we appreciate discussion with you. All we ask is stick to facts and do not present personal theory as facts.
Pat,
I have never used one of the ICE suppressors, but they do appear to be similar in operation to Polyphasers. Of course, since I have not had one on my bench, I cannot confirm this. |
Moonraker
Intermediate Member
Username: Moonraker
Post Number: 154
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, February 11, 2006 - 3:25 pm: |
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Am I the only one who has heard of soldering a wire across a SO-239 and putting it on the coax during a ligntning storm? Does this mean it's a bad idea? |
Wildrat
Advanced Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 776
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Saturday, February 11, 2006 - 7:11 pm: |
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Today at the Ham Fest in Orlando I saw what I described in the beginning of this post for sale. So maybe my idea, which has also obviously also been someone else's idea is not a bad idea. After all the Ham Bones are the radio royalty and if they are doing it, it must be a good idea, Right? |
Tech291
Moderator
Username: Tech291
Post Number: 363
Registered: 11-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, February 11, 2006 - 8:55 pm: |
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Wildrat,
Think your referring to a grounding plate in which to mount the PolyPhasors on and also making a central grounding point.PolyPhasor markets such an item.
TECH291
CEF#291
KC8ZPJ |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 2412
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, February 12, 2006 - 12:25 am: |
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(so does ICE...) |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1230
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, February 12, 2006 - 1:03 am: |
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Moonraker, that idea you posted above doesn't sound to good to me.
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Moonraker
Intermediate Member
Username: Moonraker
Post Number: 156
Registered: 3-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, February 12, 2006 - 12:17 pm: |
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Yeah, my first thought was that it would just turn the antenna into a big lightning rod, but i've been wrong before, so I had to ask. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1236
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, February 12, 2006 - 2:00 pm: |
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We have a house around here that has been
struck by lightning 4 times. 3 were average
damage and 1 charge blew the whole side of
the house off and cratered there yard.
They had no high trees or antennas. That's the
weird part as there are many high trees on
the other properties that are in the neighborhood.
Lightning is unpredictable.But, if your going
to have a ground system i believe a person
should do it right. Direct the lightning energy
away from your house with a good low impedance
grounding system. My own grounding system needs
to be improved. In my opinion 1 ground-rod just doesn't cut it. That lightning energy needs to
be led to ground without much saturation. The
only way i can see to do that is to have
multiple ground-rods spaced the proper distance apart as stated by Tech 833 in a above post.
I do believe with the proper grounding system
you can direct the energy where you want it to go.
But, i also believe that there will be those times
where there is also the chance that the side
of your house could get blown off. On the other
hand, what if that house would of had lightning
rods placed on the roof with a proper grounding
scheme. Would it of made a difference??? Hummmm
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Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1211
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Sunday, February 12, 2006 - 4:00 pm: |
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Wildrat posted: "Ham Bones are the radio royalty and if they are doing it, it must be a good idea, Right?"
Wrong! In fact, the hams are some of the worst voodoo perpetuators. If there is such a thing as 'radio royalty', it would have to be military and U.S. Govt. secure comm systems, then maybe broadcasters, then professional two-way and cellular. BTW, all of the afore mentioned use Polyphasers too.... |
Kid_vicious
Senior Member
Username: Kid_vicious
Post Number: 1184
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Monday, February 13, 2006 - 12:48 am: |
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so, should i use a polyphaser or not?
just kidding guys! i couldnt help myself. great thread!
matt |
Patzerozero
Senior Member
Username: Patzerozero
Post Number: 2421
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, February 13, 2006 - 1:32 pm: |
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ya know, kid, i was wondering the same thing . will stick with my ICE setup for now |
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