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Message |
    
Snapperhead
Intermediate Member
Username: Snapperhead
Post Number: 235
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Thursday, August 03, 2006 - 7:13 pm: | 
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Hey guys, I just moved into a new 2 story house with NO CCR's.........I mounted my Imax 2000 on second story right to the chimney.......It's around 60' to the tip of antenna......My question is I want to run a grounding wire to grounding rod from bottom of Imax, however, it's about 35 to 40' to the earth, if I run a ground that long down to grounding rod, will it send unwanted RF.......I've always ran pushup poles mounted on side of house where I grounding rod and wire where right smack down next to mast......
Also, my base station is inhouse, and nowhere near the outside......I've always had my base stations close to perimiter of house where I can run a grounding rod with wire no longer that a 1/4 wave.........I'm mainly concerned about RF and quieting down static. Right now I do have a 1.2:1 match and nothing is grounded.....Any info or advice would be appreciated |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1805
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, August 04, 2006 - 10:58 am: |
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Mast is usually painted or if using multiple
masts, the connections are not that great
for a good ground. It will be fine to attach a heavy copper wire or copper strap from Imax u-bolts to a ground-rod/s in the earth.
If you ground your radio equipment to a outside
earth ground-rod/s, that wire should be as short as possible, less than 9ft or it may radiate.
Do a search on the Copper forum as there is
many articles on grounding. Good Luck! |
Snapperhead
Intermediate Member
Username: Snapperhead
Post Number: 236
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Friday, August 04, 2006 - 6:20 pm: |
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Hey there Road Warrior......Thanks for the insight.......My grounding strap would be around 40 feet to the earth.......Is that ok, or is it to long and will cause RF??
As far as equiptment, I'm way over 9ft from equiptment to Earth......I was doing some research and found a product made by MFJ......It's MFJ-931 and It's some kind of RF ground for situations like myself, do any of ya's know about this product of is it not worth it.........Thanks |
Vanillagorilla
Advanced Member
Username: Vanillagorilla
Post Number: 727
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Friday, August 04, 2006 - 7:58 pm: |
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I think your talking about the artificial antenna? The idea is to bring a far away ground point closer to you equipment. Can't say whether its worth the green stamps or not. It IS your best bet if you feel you NEED to ground the equipment. As you probably already know to ground your stuff to a house ground like a screw on you electrical socket OR hot water pipes is a no-no.
I know some people have layed a 8-9ft length of wire along the floor and say it works for static and TVI but I have not tried it. My radios are currently NOT grounded.
As for your antenna...I feel any ground is better than none. As Road Warrior stated above although my Antron is on a mast I still ran copper the full length to the earth and soldered to 2 spikes. I don't see how a ground strap could be too long for the antenna and I don't see how it could resonate if your using good quality coax. If your signal is making it to the antenna without leakage then your ground is helping discharge static and give your antenna a ref to earth....its all GOOD....like planting roots! The more water your antenna can drink the stronger it'll be! More/deeper roots the better!
Work a little harder on that ground system at the earth. The more time you put into it the better you'll do in the long run!
Best of luck!
Hank CEF559 |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1809
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Friday, August 04, 2006 - 9:37 pm: |
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Mfj-931, way i see it, this product is just
a band-aid.
Nothing beats a well thought out short copper
wire/strap equipment ground.
40 ft to earth is fine. |
Snapperhead
Intermediate Member
Username: Snapperhead
Post Number: 238
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Friday, August 04, 2006 - 10:39 pm: |
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Thanks you guys.........Very interesting.........I'll keep you posted.......73 |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1417
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, August 05, 2006 - 12:38 am: |
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Don't waste your money on the MFJ 'artificial ground'. it is designed to patch problems that sound engineering resolve for far less money.
Run the ground from your antenna to Earth ground and disregard the length. As long as it is nearly vertical, the length does not matter. Then, run a ground wire from your shack to nearest ground and bond the antenna and equipment grounds together and live happily ever after! |
Snapperhead
Intermediate Member
Username: Snapperhead
Post Number: 240
Registered: 2-2002
| | Posted on Saturday, August 05, 2006 - 11:29 am: |
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Ha Ha Tech833.......Sounds like a fairy tale......LOL..I went to Lowe's this morning and bought a 5/8th dia. 8' grounding rod...I just need some wire to run down to it......What's a good gauge and what type?....Hey RoadWarrior, for now, I ran a 9' piece of wire from back of rig and put it down the crawl space under the house......Believe it or not, it actually killed some of the static I've been getting......It's only temporary but thanks for tip...73's |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1811
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, August 05, 2006 - 3:16 pm: |
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I really don't like to recommend how big of
a guage wire to use as it is your stuff your
trying to protect.
But, i will say nothing smaller than #6 for a
antenna safety ground if using wire. Type: Copper |
Vanillagorilla
Advanced Member
Username: Vanillagorilla
Post Number: 729
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Saturday, August 05, 2006 - 5:14 pm: |
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The ground or stray RF travels on the OUTSIDE of the ground wire. Thats why strap or braid is prefered...more surface area.."skin".
Use whatever you have. I only had 10g solid. I ran 2 lengths with a wide wrap around each other down to the spikes.
The 9ft wire you layed down off the radio acts as a counterpoise to your equipment. The length you layed down was about 1/4wave length...depending on the dia of the wire...hey..if it works!
Question though..if you can get that wire to the crawl space then why not attach it to a spike? Maybe the crawl space is not high enough to pound in a spike? I would drop in whatever length I could..again anything better than nothing!
Best of luck~
Hank CEF559 |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1813
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, August 05, 2006 - 9:09 pm: |
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I myself use 2"solid copper strap .020 thickness.
Very expensive after you get copper strap,and
all hardware to attach to ground-rods and such.
I think i paid $1.75 a ft. just for strap.
If using wire try not to use anything less
than #6 solid copper wire. |
Vanillagorilla
Advanced Member
Username: Vanillagorilla
Post Number: 732
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Sunday, August 06, 2006 - 3:30 pm: |
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..as anyone here can plainly see I'm SLOWLY dragging secrets out of Road_Warrior. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1815
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Sunday, August 06, 2006 - 8:21 pm: |
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He He He
I have no secrets Vanillagorilla...LOL |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1817
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Monday, August 07, 2006 - 1:03 am: |
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I'm using 2 inch wide solid copper strap which
can not be found at auto parts stores.
But, Tech 808 has a good idea. Check the
auto stores to see what they may have in
way of grounding straps. Worth a try...
Not sure what other types are out there.
I used #6 solid copper wire for 30 years,
just recently changed to copper strap.
So, don't knock your brains out over what to
use. |
Tech833
Intermediate Member
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 113
Registered: 12-2001
| | Posted on Monday, August 07, 2006 - 3:27 pm: |
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AES sells copper strap. That quote above for less than a buck-a-foot sounds pretty good too.
I have bought strap in 2,4, and 6 inch widths from sources like AES, Kintronics, Harris, and SCMS. Sorry, can't post links, but a quick web search will uncover the websites. |
Draft
Junior Member
Username: Draft
Post Number: 34
Registered: 7-2006
| | Posted on Monday, August 07, 2006 - 4:45 pm: |
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Does is matter is it's solid copper or mesh? I found 2" x .0225" (Solid) COPPER STRAP on a Internet Auction. Good? |
Kid_vicious
Senior Member
Username: Kid_vicious
Post Number: 1961
Registered: 9-2004
| | Posted on Monday, August 07, 2006 - 11:16 pm: |
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the solid copper strap is the better choice.
matt |
Tech833
Moderator
Username: Tech833
Post Number: 1422
Registered: 8-2002
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2006 - 10:29 am: |
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Mesh (or braid) should ONLY be used where you need it to flex a lot (like grounding pipe on a rotor). If it doesn't move constantly, use solid. |
Draft
Junior Member
Username: Draft
Post Number: 37
Registered: 7-2006
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2006 - 11:51 am: |
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Great! Thanks so, so much for the input, I picked up 50' of the 2" x .0225" (Solid) COPPER STRAP on an internet site for $63.00 +Shipping.
73's, --Rich |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1821
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2006 - 8:39 pm: |
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Good deal Draft! Copper strap has more surface
area than solid copper wire. |
Road_warrior
Senior Member
Username: Road_warrior
Post Number: 1846
Registered: 7-2004
| | Posted on Saturday, August 19, 2006 - 1:40 pm: |
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I think he already purchased the copper strap.
This is just my opinion: A lightning strike
is very hot, more hotter than anything we could
ever imagine. So, we want to get that energy
from point A to B with as less resistance as
possible. Wider solid copper strap provides less
resistance and more surface area than round #6 wire can provide.
If your going to bury under ground get solid
copper strap that's at least .020 thickness.
The farther away from your house that your
antenna, tower, ect. is mounted the better off
you probably would be. |
Vanillagorilla
Advanced Member
Username: Vanillagorilla
Post Number: 800
Registered: 4-2005
| | Posted on Wednesday, August 23, 2006 - 4:14 pm: |
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"He put these two spikes through my sacrum"
Who? What? Where? What did he say? I just passed out.....that there doesn't sound good I don't care who the doctor is!
As for the West marine tip..THANKS. There is one not 2 miles away! Also good for stainless hardware. |
Wildrat
Senior Member
Username: Wildrat
Post Number: 1007
Registered: 12-2003
| | Posted on Monday, August 28, 2006 - 2:53 pm: |
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I am pretty lucky where my 20 is. I have a West Marine, Auto Zone, Advanced Discount Auto Parts just down the street, and I have Lowes about 3 miles from the house. I can usually find all my cheaper non CB radio equivalents at these stores. Usually the parts I find are better than the stuff I buy from radio shops.
I have a blue some kind of foam pad that I cut out of a camping ground pad to put on my bike seat till I can get the seat to the seat shop that works good. I put 400 miles on the bike this weekend and I had no pain in my tail to speak of, just the normal pain.
WR |
